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Hone Identifications please? (pic heavy!)

Hey all! I've been around for a while (here and on SRP) and finally got around to taking a few pics of my coticules. Would love to get some kind of ID on them if possible. They are all natural Combo stones. Enjoy the pics and many thanks!

Coticule 1: Got this off Ebay. It's a natural combo that's ~1.25" thick. Has some beautiful coloring to it ranging from a pale yellow to caramel in spots.

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Coticule 2: This one I haven't really experimented with a whole lot. With water, it doesn't seem to produce an edge as nice as coticule 3 below, but I feel it is faster, as the slurry darkens much faster. The pictures might not show it well, but it has some nice red/pink coloring to it.

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and a side view...

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Coticule 3: This was my first, and I have to say it is my favorite. It is paler yellow than Coticule 1, and I believe gives the smoothest edge of the 3 I have at the moment. With just water it will produce a very nice edge in my limited experience with a coti.

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and a side view...

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Slurry stones: The triangular one is a very light yellow, and the other is a grey color.

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Group shot: Just a shot of them all together to compare.

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Sorry for being pic heavy!
 

tzee

Active Member
I'm an amateur, so take my opinions with a grain of salt.

1. Vintage? Need side shots too.

2. La Grise

3. La Petite Blanche?

You need to provide side pics of the slurry stones, but the bottom one that you called gray is most likely La Grise or perhaps La Verte.
 

danjared

Well-Known Member
The first, being an old production stone, is almost impossible to identify with any certainty.

The second is difficult for me to determine. Can you take more pictures? Also, did you mean that it's fast on slurry and on water? Does the surface darken with swarf at all when using just water? It's difficult to say, but it might be Les Latneuses.

The third is most likely La Veinette.

I don't know about the slurry stones without side views.
 
Ok, I will take a few more pictures today and put them up shortly.

Dan - as far as the 2nd one goes, what would you like as far as pics?
 

tzee

Active Member
I never pegged the last one for La Veinette due to the distinct blue line running along the side, the spots, and the absence of white lines on the side.
 
Ok, got a few more pictures for you all. Dan, for the 2nd one, when using slurry, it darkens fairly fast, but with just water, it took about 30+ x-strokes before I saw ANY sign of swarf. Coti #3 WITH slurry is not nearly as fast as #2. Took about 3x as many half strokes before the slurry got close to the darkness of #2. Coti #3 with just water was slow as well, and also took about 20-30 x-strokes before swarf could be seen. And as I said before, all the stones (including slurry stones) are natural combo's.

Slurry Stone #1 :

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Slurry Stone #2 :

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Coti #1 : Yes, it appears to be a vintage one, judging from the box it came in, but here's more pictures. The BBW side isn't as "dark" as Coti's #2 and #3. You can't see as much "spotting" of garnets as the other 2. The BBW on #2/#3 appear more "red" in color.

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Coti #2 : More pics

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Bart

Well-Known Member
Coticule #1: an old Coticule, that could possibly come from one of many "unmapped" layers. It does make me think of some La Grosse Blanches I've seen, but that doesn't mean it necessarily is one.

Coticule #2: Likely La Grise.

Coticule #3: La Nouvelle Veine.

Kind regards,
Bart.
 

danjared

Well-Known Member
Bart said:
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I'm just wondering, how come La Nouvelle Veine? From the blue splotches and areas with a reddish/pink tinge, I would have thought La Veinette. The thin lines of blue on the side also contributed to me thinking La Veinette.
 

tzee

Active Member
Bart, I'm also curious. Aside from those spots, I can see it being La Nouvelle Veine, although I've never heard of a spotted one. Pray tell?
 
Interesting information! Many thanks! Maybe this is a topic for another thread, but say you have a hone from one vein (take your pick) and the slurry stone is from a different vein...does that make any difference on the result you get when honing? Will the slurry have the properties associated with the hone or the slurry stone? Maybe my thoughts are ridiculous, but it was just a thought that came to mind.

If there is a possibility that #1 is a LGB, I will sit it out in the sunlight to see if it darkens at all. Not sure if all LGB exhibit that property or not, but I will try it to see. How long do you think it would take in the sun to see any changes?

Again, thanks Bart, Dan, and the rest!

Dan - Any thoughts on the slurry stones?
 

tzee

Active Member
It does not make a difference regardless of the slurry stone used. You can mix and match as you please.
 

Paul

Well-Known Member
La Veinette will have white lines running in the axial plane in the BBW seen on the lateral walls.

I have been admiring the first stone quite a bit. Very enchanting little stone there :)
 
Paul said:
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Thanks! Although I have not spent much time with #1 as of yet, I do love the "look" of it. Very pretty.

As far as the "white lines" you mentioned in the BBW, please tell me if the images below are what you mean. The images are from #3, the hone in question.

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danjared

Well-Known Member
Based on my understanding, yes, that is the kind of white line found in the BBW that's adjacent to La Veinette.
 

Paul

Well-Known Member
Yes, that's what I was looking for. I didn't see those in the original pics. I'm not one to question Bart, but I'd have guessed (clearly) what Jared did... Either way, it's very nice :)
 
Understood! I realized that my initial pics of #3 didn't accurately show all the details. Honestly, the white lines are a bit hidden when the stone is dry...wetting the side makes them stand out. I originally thought they might just be from the cutting/grinding process.

Bart, do you think with the last 2 pictures it may be LV instead of LNV? Not that it really matters to me, I love them all, but would love to know something about where they came from :D
 

garyhaywood

Well-Known Member
the green striprd box, that box i have seen and had one , that i borrowed, i'm sure on the box it was called the old rock version of coti's?

the one i tryed was criss wdrx, and the edges were difficult to get keen but boy when i say mellow i mean the edges were mellow, as in they felt superbly dull, and forging
 

Bart

Well-Known Member
danjared said:
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Check out
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. It's a La Nouvelle Veine with some manganese traces.

Thin blue hairlines are the tale-telling sings of La Nouvelle Veine, although this on occasion has to be overruled by stronger other features that can swing a determination otherwise. E.g. one side of Les Latneuses has the blue hairlines as well. La Nouvelle Veine often has "woodgrain" appearance, whereas Les Latneuses has not. I've put "hairlines" in bold, because thicker blue lines can be seen in many layers, often La Grise and La Dressante.
La Nouvelle Veine sometimes shows a bit of a blotchy surface, as if some of the blue shines through at spots. I believe that's because the hairlines are often wavering a bit.

Blue hairlines have nothing to do with La Veinette. La Veinette is recognized because it's in 99% of cases naturally bonded to a BBW, and has thin white lines in the side of that BBW. La Veinette is also a layer without "woodgrain" appearance. I think presence of "woodgrain" overrules white lines in the BBW part of a natural combo.

Concerning "woodgrain", I can also say that La Grise generally seems to be the layer with the most pronounced "woodgrain", with the longest fibers. Often part of these "fibers" are red within La Grise, without any redness in the base color Redness or pinkness of the base color is usually indicative of La Dressante, and occasionally La Veinette, rarely Le Petite Blanche.
The red striations we see on #2 here is a major reason for me to declare it La Grise. Woodgrain with red striation spells La Grise in my mind.

We can see that #3 has grain, albeit more modest than #2, and from what I can see in the pictures, it does have blue hairlines at the side. Hence I called La Nouvelle Veine.

The fact that the owner states this stone to leave the smoothest edge of the three, seemed to further concur with that determination.

But determinations remain tricky business. I can only state what I think it is, and other opinions are as good as my own.

Kind regards,
Bart.
 
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