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if somebody could help

ovnifou

Active Member
Hello,

I am living in Geneva, Switzerland. I have used japanese whetstones for the last 22ys to sharpen and hone my woodworking tools, used to build fishing rods, bamboo fishing rods. Lost in the world of japnats, I even did never heard anything about Coticule until I start to shave with straight, not long time ago. The first stone are on the way from Ardennes, I can't wait 'till they come! My problem is not concerning coticule or bbw but thuringian stones. I found one nice piece in England, wanted to compare it with the belgian. Here are the pictures
stone410.jpg

stone411.jpg

stone412.jpg

stone413.jpg

it was said to be a vintage thuringian, 15k grit (I knew it was wrong, fine OK but not so fine), the problem is it came with a nice invisible crack. First attempt to make slurry and crack!!!!
stone414.jpg

alright, it can be, Murphy's Law I think, the problem is, I was already thinking about that, this seems for me by no way being a thuringian, just slate certainly but once broken was it clear.
Am I right or am I so ignorant about the german honig stones?
Thank you for the help if you can
 

Matt

Well-Known Member
Hello and welcome to the coticule.be!

I've never laid my hands on a thuringian, so I won't help with that. But, one thing that came to my mind is, that if upon first use it cracked all the way down, it could be a shitty seller who ruined the stone, put it together with a few drops of super glue and let it go. Suspicious, I know. Did you inspect the crack for any traces of glue, or are you sure it was 'virgin', so to say? On the other hand the stone might get that during shipping, too. :|

Others will help, I'm sure.

regards,
Matt
 

ovnifou

Active Member
thank you for answering! I thought the same but no trace of glue or anything. BUT there are traces of tools EXACTLY on the breaking line on the backside, this was surely the weak point (weak line?) of the stone.
 

TM280

Well-Known Member
Hi,
Sorry about your stone. I am not going to make a guess at what it is, I am not sure it is even possible from those pictures. But I am guessing that it was originally 150 mm long? If so, then you should have a piece that is 100 mm long. (unless that slurry stone is the size of a pea and throwing off my size estimations...)

I just wanted to say that the stone should still be fine to finish on. I often finish on stones no longer than 100 mm, and the width would allow you do do circles if you felt you needed to correct for the shorter stroke.

Good luck:thumbup:

regards,
Torolf
 

ovnifou

Active Member
Thank you Torolf, the stone is a little bit shorter, the remaining biggest piece is 80mm long now. The problem is not really for me but the guy is still selling stones. Part of them are now described as slate and others as thuringians and I want to know in order to make that stopping if I'm right. I don't want others to have a similar disappointment. Have a nice evening:cry:
 

TM280

Well-Known Member
I understand. The best thing to do is probably get in touch with one of our experienced members in Switzerland. "Blue Dun" springs to mind.

regards,
Torolf
 

Bart

Well-Known Member
Welcome to Coticule.be!

Thüringer hones are a type of slate, hence it is not out of the ordinary that you've identified this hone to be slate.
Cracks do occur in natural rock. If the crack was invisible to you, it was likely just as invisible for the seller. That leaves you with an unfortunate problem, that has my deepest sympathy, but that you will have to likely swallow on your own.
I once bought a couple of chickens. They looked perfectly healthy and happy when I picked up them at the seller. Two days later, in my coop, they started dropping dead. I had 5, of which only 2 survived. I took the last corps back to the seller. He didn't even let me bring it in, afraid as he was that a decease would spread among his own stock. The man told me this: "Before you paid them, the chickens we mine, and I carried the risk of loosing them, at a fox or at a virus, doesn't matter. After you paid for them, that risk become yours." It was near the end of the season, and he told me to come back after a couple more weeks. While he didn't have to do that, he let me choose from what few stock he had left before he closed down during winter. I still have those chickens. They are not as pretty as the ones I had first, but the eggs are excellent. :)

Kind regards,
Bart.
 

ovnifou

Active Member
While being sad, I fully understand that the "accident" is certainly not the seller's fault. As I said, it's only Murphy's Law, maybe the lapping at seller's shop, maybe the travel, maybe just bad luck... I try to be always polite and kind, as rudeness never give good results... just wanted to identify the stone better as the broken parts gave me an inside look that brought a lot of questions about the origin.

Just tried to protects other potential buyers... Anyway, I will NEVER buy a natural sharpening stone through internet for a high price, so my loss isn't that bad, after all, it is just money but I still don't know if it's just a piece of slate or a thuringian.
 

ovnifou

Active Member
Alright, to make the story short, nice happy ending!:) the seller told me he never should have sent the stone "lightly" packed so I just have a nice old thüringian in replacement, but only 6mm thick... a really really good stone but anyway, it is NOT 15k as said, I can only give confirmation that a coticule is finer to finish. The patterns given by one stone type is not the same as the other, so the best thing is either Thüringian OR Coticule. I think I will sell it but the new owner should glue it on something, hard wood or another stone because 6mm is thin
Thank's to all fellows
 

BlueDun

Well-Known Member
Pascal,
Mind if I chime in:rolleyes:
Maybe you are better off now with the replacement stone. AJ is a friendly seller, I bought several hones from him myself. I also do have one like the one hat broke on you. It's a decent hone, maybe even a finisher for tools, but it' surely lacking that extra bit for a good razor finisher. Not even close to what a coti or a fine Jnat can do. So hopefully you are lucky with the new Thuringian. And if not .... hey, got a coti and some (presumably) nice Jnats. Thehere's really nothing more you need!

Cheers
BluDun
 

ovnifou

Active Member
Thank you Blue Dun, I already traded a JNat finisher for some Coti's. I just start to know well the Petite Blanche, The Veinette I got too is a wild one, not yet domesticated! Concerning the Slate Stone, that is my problem, it is by no way as good as any of my others, was thinking it was finer as it is, really good for knives and tools, but too thin for tools, where I do anyway prefer the oil stones to water. I can not even think about water in the workshop, near my prone to rust tools!
 

Pieterman

New Member
In one of his Thuringian auctions AJ mentioned he got it from Czech Republic. Perhaps that's true or perhaps he bought some slate and marble tiles from a DIY centre and has been cutting them. Newly cut hones are usually plenty thick, all his brand new looking stones are thin like tiles. I really doubt the stones he sells are Thuringians because of their looks and he describes them as being very hard.

The stone breaking on you is just bad luck. It's good of AJ he sent a replacement stone, but I won't believe its an old Thuringian untill I see it :D
 

ovnifou

Active Member
That was the origin of my thread... I was in Germany and holland long enough as an apprentice stone worker to remember the old Thüringians. This is just a piece of slate and even when said being 15k grit is it at best 6k, even worked with a finer grit to lap it. The money wasn't too much but this is not the problem. When you sell a piece of slate with the clear description "Vintage Thüringian Hone" you better have to change it fast when it's broken. Anyway I asked yesterday to a better knowing person who could confirm the origin. So I WILL NOT SELL IT, end of the story. My daughter loves to play with it and her kid's Opinel, she plays like her dad with the razors and knives and she's happy, so am I:p
 

ovnifou

Active Member
To be honest, as I felt really mad about some bad business last weeks, I contacted the seller because I wanted to be sure of the origin of the stone and the knowledge of him about that.
He was really nice a offered a complete refund, too fast for may taste. He just doesn't know what a thüringian really is and was not able to say honestly it wasn't just a piece of slate, I know it is that.
Sellers should be more careful with words and names. An old piece of honing grey slate is not a thüringian, end of the story.
And by the way even that seems a really fine grit is far from being 15k. Alas, just tired to fight, feels like Don Quichotte and the wind mills
 

tat2Ralfy

Well-Known Member
Crikey Pascal!

What with this pair of stones, one broken and one a slate, and the half dozen razors you have had quite a bumpy ride so far eh?

Best wishes for a smoother straight razor future
Ralfson (Dr)
 

ovnifou

Active Member
oooopssss:blush: you caught me:blush: :blush: :blush: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
correction please, both stones were slate, that is the problem. I think I was honest telling the truth on that thread, the real problem for me is how fast and easy the seller gave the money back, is it because he is so honest and kind or because he knew from the start what he was selling?
Don't know but I keep being confident on human nature, will just look twice and be careful
Thank you Dr, keep a well opened eye on things being said, it is important
 
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