New Bartmann

Jantjeuh

Well-Known Member
Ok not NEW, but you know, newly received. It was part from a lot. It seems someone found razors from one guy and sold them all together. I say this because each razor seems to have been maintained a little bit better, the Bartmann even having its spine taped, and oiled up :) One of the lot even has home made scales with screws around them, lol.

Anyhow, I'm in love with this razor. It looks and feels so perfect. The scales, I personaly think they are excellent, the blade in OK condition etc.. Not sure what this would have been back in the day, but I think it was a pretty darn good beast. If I put it against my Dovo Astrale this one looks huge, exactly what I was hoping for. it seems on the spine there used to be gold, crazy.

Bart, I remember you having a few of these, you happen to have this particular model? Do you know a little bit more about them?

My question though, after hours of sanding the tang which was rusty like an old volkswagen, and polishing it with steel wire and dursol (kinda like Maas) it seems I've about reached the end of where I can get without having to sand the blade.

I would like to avoid sanding the poor blade, so I'm wondering if it is OK to leave it like this, or will the rust come back to life and go nuts on the blade? Is it harmful to shave with it like this (for my face and or razor).

Here are the pics, these pics don't do it any justice:



 

Jantjeuh

Well-Known Member
The steel on this one, I believe they market it as Manganese or so, is different from my other razors, or perhaps it is because of the way they made the blade I don't know, it seems very hard steel.
 

Bart

Well-Known Member
Ha. A Bartmann 504. Great razor. Manganese steel. An excellent shaver.
If you can get a hold to a few of those metallic ink pens, you could recolor the blade.


Rust attracts moisture, so my advice is to get rid of it. I bet Smythe will chime in later. He's kinda the resident restoration master. I believe Ralfy is quite knowledgeable as well. We should start a restoration forum.

I personally hate hand sanding. I use a jewelers lathe equipped with 3M abrasive bristle discs myself. It works very well. You're free to drop by with the razor and give it a try.

Here's a quick picture of the setup, borrowed from "google pictures":


The bristle discs exist from grit 40 all the way to 14000

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The lathe can also be equipped with buffing wheels. Variable speed control. An excellent little machine. Less dangerous than a full-blown buffer too.

Bart.
 

Jantjeuh

Well-Known Member
Sweet lord, I can refill the color? I'll start looking for those pens for sure then. I wonder if they sell them at Brico, I noticed they have an entire new 'art' department.

I would pass by, but I have never used that tool in any way, I'd be for sure messing up the poor blade so I'll pass this time. Perhaps if I have another less good looking blade I'll take you up on the offer though :)

I'm urious about Smythe's verdict as well now.

As far as I understand the actual 'rust' should have been dissolved, I used some type of product for that which dissolves rust.

But let's say, I want to sand these last bits out. What grit paper could I use, and dry or wet? Is it ok to sand only a number of spots, or is it then required to sand the entire blade (ruining the etching) ?
 

tat2Ralfy

Well-Known Member
Nice looking razor :thumbup: and with Sir Barts seal of approval its gotta be a :thumbup: :thumbup: one that one.

Mmm as for the "rust" issue, I believe Cedric has far more experience with Razors than myself, but heres my take on it.
I dont see any "Rust" just the light surface pitting it has left behind, or "patina" as people who are posh might call it, so I think you are safe from rust attack, for now at least, but that pitting will attract and hold moisture so, if you wipe the blade with rubbing alcohol and a little light oil every time you have used it I think it will last a lifetime with just the odd polish with the autosol every now and again, I have blades that are etched and in order to keep that I have done pretty much what you did to this by the sounds of it.
one thing you could try that is very kind on the blade and leaves only marks that will come out with Autosol is a pencil eraser, you know the kind that has 2 ends, one smooth and one a little rougher, I have used the rougher end on light marks to good effect, it takes time and patience but you will not hurt the blade with it, try it and see how it goes.
There are of course lots of creams and pastes too, all with more or less cutting power, its rather like using a hone, you can use something that leaves little scratches e.g. scouring powder, and then use kinder and kinder stuff untill you back to a deep shine, as long as you have enough elbow grease that is!...lol
 

Jantjeuh

Well-Known Member
It shaved like a dream.. the best shave I've ever had. Incredible razor. I'm googling for the history of the darn Beard man, but can't seem to find anything on them, I have the impression they made only high quality razors, this thing is a piece of art imo.
 

justin

Well-Known Member
That's a sweet razor. It has a kind of medieval look to it. I want to find something unique like that to have as my main shaver. To tell you the truth I think most razor are pretty ugly, or they just don't have that je ne sais quoi that appeals to me.
 

Smythe

Well-Known Member
Nooooooooo!!! Don’t sand that blade or you will lose the etching.
Were it not for the etch than I would say “sure, go to town with the polish” but that etching is what “marks” that blade as the top-of-the-line “Bartmann”, as much as a Wade&Butcher has its Arrow and Cross. In fact, I have a Philharmonic #14 in similar condition and decided not to polish (well… maybe after I perfect my blade re-etching technique).
Yes the blade face may have a few spots, and it would be nice to get them out, but it’s such a handsome blade I wouldn’t have the hart to polish it. I would live with the few stains, but in this case, make a special effort to properly dry with paper towel after use and store in a paper box (paper absorbs moisture and will help to keep the razor inside the box dry).

To get that mirror polish shine (hopefully another blade without etching) you first must remove the scratch marks from the previous grit in the progression (and of course before that… getting rid of pitting). I my opinion removing previous scratch marks is the most frustrating part of the restore… you often don’t see them until progressing two or three grits higher and then you have to go back. This is why I recommend a machine such as the one Bart pictured instead of hand sanding, the lower the RPM and the higher the torque, the better (variable speed).
When you get to 2000 grit, the finish should be shiny enough to see your detailed reflection in the blade face with little “haze”. Then medium hard felt wheels with compounds until the finish is mirror (I personally do not like cloth wheels especially with hi RPM machines, cloth wheels do not hold as much polish as felt, then almost immediately the polish is used up and friction begins heat the steel).

Some folks complain about “swirl marks” in the mirror finish, but these can be avoided with proper “cleanliness”. Swirl marks are mostly caused by lower grits getting into the polishing wheel.
Probably most of us (myself included) sand and polish with the same machine such as the Dremmel, we sand or use wheels of lower grits first and then polish. But we almost never clean the machine and the surroundings before going to the higher grit or before polishing… dust in the air can cause it too… and wash your hands and the blade with soap and water… believe me when I tell you the same thing occurs when the odd grit gets on your polishing stone will chip the edge when honing… it only takes one grit in the felt wheel to cause those thousands of little scratches that we call swirl marks.
Also, keep polishing wheels in closed containers when not in use… preferably sort buy grit sizes in separate containers and not all together in the same container.

If your wheels become rounded at the corners or clogged, blackened and sticky with old polish you may want to “dress” the wheel with an old rasp or old wood file with large teeth (wear a dust mask when doing this) to expose fresh material ready for more polish. Or you may clean the wheel with solvent to dissolve the old polish and extend the service life of the wheel.

Oh and one secret I will leave with you… If you use a Dremmel or any machine that uses Dremmel size/type polishing wheels, then get the biggest polishing wheels available… 1 and ½ inch (40mm) diameter or larger… those sizes are a perfect fit for the concave of most hollow ground razors. If you use smaller wheels, you would have to roll from spine to edge as you go the length of the blade to cover the whole concave and will leave an uneven finish.
 

Jantjeuh

Well-Known Member
Can someone explain why this is happening:

after using it several times (what a celebration :love: ) I keep whiping the blade with paper tissues at the end, and it seems the blade is now slowly gaining a nicer and nicer look.

I would guess the paper is not the cause of this, is it perhaps that after a while the leftover 'rust traces' just fall off, because the maas like product has some type of after effect?

I noticed the same effect on a sheffield blade I have, but there it took much longer.

I'm not saying the blade is now perfect, far from it, but there's less 'gunk' on the blade than after the first restore.

Oh and, yes, it still shaves like a dream, I don't need another razor anymore :scared: :w00t: :scared:
 
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