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Raw Coticule hone 1

TM280

Well-Known Member
I thought I'd share some information about my newest hone, and ask for some input.
This is one of the pieces of raw coticule that I picked up at the mine on Saturday. I think it was immensely generous of Maurice to let us pluck what we wanted. The whole experience was a bit overwhelming, in a fantastic kind of way.
This was a densely layered somewhat flat piece of rock: red, yellow, blue and greenish grey. And hard.

What it became is a roughly 50 mm x 124 mm x 25 mm hone (that would be 9 x 2 x 1 inches...), plus a sizable piece that will become a bout large enough to hone razors on. It weighs in at 900 grams.

The coloring is mainly pinkish full of yellow dots, what I would call a blush, with some green-grey sparkly tones. The layers are grey, dark purple and spotted pink.

This is a hard hone, little audible feedback, ok slurry generation. I believe it is fast on slurry: grey after the first half set of 30 half strokes, close to black after two sets of 30 half strokes. But the length may be giving a cutting advantage, I will know something more accurate after I test the bout.

Slow on water with a silent, glassy feel but a surprisingly pleasant draw. I honed up the razor in the pictures dilucot, going a little slow with the dilution. Fantastic results in usability. Before dilution, cutting arm hair well above the skin. Clear edge keenness refinement through dilution. I may have gone a little fast since I was getting a 2-3 HHT after water laps. Went back to some half strokes on water, then about sixty light x strokes and was at a spotty 3 HHT. After a good stropping it was a solid 4-5 HHT. Very little effort in my opinion.

The shave was very good, perhaps a bit crisp for me. My first thought was that I could get exceptional keenness off this hone but may want to do a little finishing on another afterwords. Maybe not...

Bart: Could you give me your thoughts on layer possibilities? By comparing to your information in the vault I though that color wise, and perhaps it's cutting speed, it could be a La Dressante, but the green grey figuring and layers makes me think of Les Latneuses.

Here are the pictures, the razor I rescaled last month (in bone) for size comparison. No real color change when it is wet actually. I am having trouble with my lighting so I hope the details are clear enough. (the colors on my monitor look fairly accurate, though the yellow appears more green in the post than in real life)

Hope you like it.
regards,
Torolf

before
1


1


1


1


next two are wet

1


1
 

decraew

Well-Known Member
Wonderful Torolf!

I hope I'll soon find time to work on my own "souvenirs" from the mine as well ...

What I like most about the stone are the rough natural edges.
 

TM280

Well-Known Member
Thanks, it seemed to be the proper way to shape it. I may engrave the date on the back if I think I could do a presentable job of it.

regards,
Torolf
 

urmas

Well-Known Member
Hi Torolf,

Do you have leftovers of raw coticule, maybe 2x14cm or something like that?

Looking with hope from a bottom to top, :rolleyes:
Urmas
 

Hendrik

Member
Hi Torolf,

Very nice work indeed!

Could you please share how you have achieved this result?

I have similar work awaiting me B) and am tinkering about the best way to proceed.
For lapping I have a DMT C at my disposal, but I have no idea how best to cut the raw piece into a sizeable hone. For now I am thinking of just using a metalsaw (handheld).

Kind regards,

Hendrik
 

TM280

Well-Known Member
Do you have leftovers of raw coticule, maybe 2x14cm or something like that?

Hi Urmas, sorry, when I straightened up the side I cut as close to the edge as I could. Only splinters remained of that cut. The other side will be a bout for a friend of mine here. If he decides he doesn't like it then I could pass it on to you.

Could you please share how you have achieved this result?

Hi Hendrik, all I can say is get ready. What Maurice does in 5 minutes in the shop took me five hours at home. What was a pleasant surprise was that my diamond blade for my angle grinder did a really good job. On this stone, very clean cuts. But on more creamy, soft coticule, flakes were ripped out. Not big pieces, but enough to have to lap down more than I had hoped. I went through a good many 60 and 80 grit belts on my upside down clamped belt sander. Also a lot of heat generation. The rock got too hot to touch at some points.

Then to lapidary grit (80) on glass for a long time and so DMTC to smooth it all out. With better tools, perhaps one could avoid the hand cramps:thumbdown: , but all in all, I think this went rather well for me. Watch out for uneven pressure along the length of the rock.

I also managed to salvage a Les Latneuses bout but I wont put up pictures until I have a chance to test it well enough.

regards,
Torolf
 

decraew

Well-Known Member
I'm not too comfortable with an angle grinder so I think I will look around in my neighbourhood for a floorer (?). These persons typically use a diamond circulare saw with water cooling.

In order to actually flatten the stone, I'll follow Torolfs lead and use a belt sander (not wet because I think the belts would quickly become clogged). So dry and outside because I don't have a decent vacuum cleaner for this sort of work.
 

urmas

Well-Known Member
Special stone cutting tools are sometimes available at construction workers. Some time ago I let one of a fireplace builder to cut along the length my big and heavy Chinese 12K. The results were excellent - I now have 2 Chinese 12K and those are half as much lighter original Chinese 12K but the size is same.

Regards,
Urmas
 

urmas

Well-Known Member
TM280 said:
Hi Urmas, sorry, when I straightened up the side I cut as close to the edge as I could. Only splinters remained of that cut. The other side will be a bout for a friend of mine here. If he decides he doesn't like it then I could pass it on to you.

Thanks Torolf,
Urmas
 

decraew

Well-Known Member
urmas said:
Hi Torolf,

Do you have leftovers of raw coticule, maybe 2x14cm or something like that?

Looking with hope from a bottom to top, :rolleyes:
Urmas

Urmas, if you're willing to pay for the shipment cost from Belgium, I think I have a piece that may interest you. I'll check the dimensions and will let you know both dimensions and the shipping cost ok ?
 

torbenbp

Well-Known Member
That is the most impressive coticule I have ever seen. Loads of character and a solid look.
The rugged and raw edges looks facinating.
Impressive work you did there:thumbup:
Most respectful regards
Torbs
 

Woodash

Well-Known Member
Beautiful stone! :w00t: Looks like it might be worth lacquering the sides for stability?...


decraew said:
...I will look around in my neighbourhood for a floorer (?). These persons typically use a diamond circulare saw with water cooling.
Yes, there are many places where you can rent a water-cooled, diamond 'tile saw' for 1/2 or one day for ~cheap.
 

urmas

Well-Known Member
decraew said:
urmas said:
Hi Torolf,
Do you have leftovers of raw coticule, maybe 2x14cm or something like that?

Looking with hope from a bottom to top, :rolleyes:
Urmas

Urmas, if you're willing to pay for the shipment cost from Belgium, I think I have a piece that may interest you. I'll check the dimensions and will let you know both dimensions and the shipping cost ok ?

Yes, this is very suitable.

Thanks,
Urmas
 

TM280

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the kind words, Torbs.

The stone is solid through and through, no need to lacquer. There is a tiny chip-like bit I will be watching, but unless I take a hammer to it, I believe that everything will remain where it belongs.

regards,
Torolf
 

Hendrik

Member
decraew said:
Oh, you picked up rocks too ?? Hadn't noticed :lol: :p

@ decraew
That's because they were hidden in my socks :lol: :lol: :lol:

@ Torolf & others
Thank you all for sharing some ideas on how to work these stones.
With better tools it indeed should be relatively easy, but I am afraid I am even less equipped than you for this kind of work. Maybe I should indeed look into renting a tile-saw for half a day or so...

I will certainly post back once I get around this*

Regards,
Hendrik

* some urgency has arisen though, after my wife discovered a pile of rocks under my closet last night :blink:
 

Bart

Well-Known Member
Torolf,

First off: I like the new avatar! :)

The stone looks absolutely stunning. My estimation of the layer name matches yours. Could be a La Dressante, but Les Latneuses is also a big possibility. I should be able to take a good close look to the surface to make sure.
When you stated:
The coloring is mainly pinkish full of yellow dots, what I would call a blush
a little bell rang somewhere in the back of my head, and I went searching through some pictures.
1

Is this what you mean by "pinkish with yellow dots"? In that case, it's a Les Latneuses. The "upside" typically produces a "brisk" to "engaging" edge. If you can manage to use the "backside", or "hybrid side" as we call it, that would probably leave a mellow edge.

To those who were talking about renting a powered saw:
I've had good experience when sawing with a water lubricated diamond saw, but bad experiences when sawing dry with a grinder, equipped with a diamond saw for cutting concrete. The latter had a tendency to shatter the Coticule.
If you can spare a bit of extra time, it's actually fairly easy to cut a coticule with a hacksaw (powered or not). You'll ruin a blade, or you could start with a worn blade as well. Pour water in the saw kerf and add carborundum powder (or if you don't have that; plain sharp sand), for extra speed. It works better than you might think and it allows for precise cuts.

Kind regards,
Bart.
 

TM280

Well-Known Member
Thanks Bart, I've got a thing for old machines...

You're spot on with the pink with dots, thanks! Mine looks exactly like that. Les Latneuses it is:)
The backside is also of the same makeup, part of the reason I didn't try to flatten it out. What would appear to be a hybrid layer is directly in the middle of the stone. I am certain it would not survive me trying to saw it thinner, even if I thought it may have sufficient integrity at a approx. 12 mm thickness. Which I really don't.

I agree with your advice on the saws. I believe my grinder only worked so well on this piece due to it's hardness. I lost a bit on a softer piece of rock.

A strange experience, from rock to hone to shave...I can't seem to stop looking at these damn rocks...:D

regards,
Torolf
 

Bart

Well-Known Member
TM280 said:
Thanks Bart, I've got a thing for old machines...
Your talking to someone who has a woodshop filled with 1950's woodworking machines, buddy!
TM280 said:
You're spot on with the pink with dots, thanks! Mine looks exactly like that. Les Latneuses it is:)
Great!

TM280 said:
The backside is also of the same makeup, part of the reason I didn't try to flatten it out. What would appear to be a hybrid layer is directly in the middle of the stone. I am certain it would not survive me trying to saw it thinner, even if I thought it may have sufficient integrity at a approx. 12 mm thickness. Which I really don't.
You're right of course. You got a very beautiful hone out of that chunk. I wouldn't push my luck with trying to expose that hybrid part either. Let me go through my own raw rocks. I believe there's a piece of "hybrid" somewhere. I bet you have a piece of leather I can use.:rolleyes:

Kind regards,
Bart.
 
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