Unicot...

Andreas63

Well-Known Member
I’m glad to report that I finally succeeded with the Unicot method :lol: :lol:

I’m not a newbie to honing but it took some time to succeed…so with this post I’d like to help other coti-beginners in their struggle to reach the nice Unicot edge.

I know that there are a lot of very useful posts in the forum but I would like to write and report what I’ve learned so others may avoid my mistakes :):)

1)Read the instructions written by Bart…and follow them! So easy and so difficult at the same time :w00t: ! My biggest mistake: I’m not new to honing, (actually I’m a managing director for a big company that has grinding, gear cutting, gear shaving,and sharpening as core business)…then I have honed a lot of razors on Naniwa hones, so, I was thinking that I could do it my own way (only a little :blush: :blush: ). WRONG :scared: :scared: ! Follow the instructions very very strictly…Coticules and synthetics hones are not the same thing.

2)Start with a full hollow or an extra full hollow (I started with 1/4 and ½ hollows).

3)Learn the difference milky slurry/slurry. That’s very important. When I succeeded I saw the “milky wave” in front of the razor. Milky slurry is very different from a milky pulp…

4)If the instructions say “light pressure”, then it’s light pressure! Very very light.

5)“It’s not the arrow it’s the Indian”! 99.9% it’s nothing wrong with your coticule…do not buy another one until you can use and manage the one you own. I was thinking that something had to be wrong with my own, so I was tempted to buy another one. Wait and learn to use the coti you own first. Wait until you will get the “key to the magic code”.B)

6)If the all Unicot is difficult to perform...I found easier to set the bevel with the Naniwa
1 000 and then “jump” into the Unicot. After that it was much easier to set bevels according to the Unicot.

I glued four rubber pads under my coti to prevent it from “moving” around during the honing strokes. I find it a little difficult to hone with my coti in my left hand (may be because it’s 20 cm long and heavy). So having it stable on the table helped a lot.

I modified the Unicot a little to my coti: I did 100 laps on clean water. The edge was even sharper without loosing smoothness.

To summarize my own experiences: Instructions+pressure+slurry consistence are the keys to success for us “ coti-beginners”. And a lot of perseverance!

In other words I’m so glad I did not give up with coti :lol: :lol: :lol:

So, now I’ve ordered my nr.2 : a very nice nr. 10 Bout…:love:
 

Paul

Well-Known Member
I think this is an excellent post. Coticules are very different than the synthetic stones that I learned on. It's a willingness to follow instructions, with only minor tweaking, is what makes for early success (assuming you have a decent honing stroke). Congratulations on the success and the new acquisition!
 

Bart

Well-Known Member
Excellent news and an excellent write-up.:thumbup:
Thank you for sharing, Andreas.

I remember when I was new to Coticules and razor sharpening. Even with 20 years of shaving arm hair with freshly hone chisels and plane blade, it took me a loooong time before my Coticule granted me a good edge. It's almost as if they have a mind of their own and demand that you pay them proper attention before they're willing to humor you. They sure must be female!:D

Kind regards,
Bart.
 

Andreas63

Well-Known Member
richmondesi said:
I think this is an excellent post. Coticules are very different than the synthetic stones that I learned on. It's a willingness to follow instructions, with only minor tweaking, is what makes for early success (assuming you have a decent honing stroke). Congratulations on the success and the new acquisition!
Thanks :)
As you are writing: the willingness to follow instructions is one of the most important "keys"...and that's the most difficult if you are new to cotis but not new to honing!
 

Andreas63

Well-Known Member
Bart said:
Excellent news and an excellent write-up.:thumbup:
Thank you for sharing, Andreas.

I remember when I was new to Coticules and razor sharpening. Even with 20 years of shaving arm hair with freshly hone chisels and plane blade, it took me a loooong time before my Coticule granted me a good edge. It's almost as if they have a mind of their own and demand that you pay them proper attention before they're willing to humor you. They sure must be female!:D

Kind regards,
Bart.
Thanks!

I agree that they must be female: you must take your time to listen, pay attention etc...and never, never give up :D :lol: :lol:
 

tat2Ralfy

Well-Known Member
Wonderful wonderful news! well done and what a superb write up :thumbup:

I would add just 1 thing, dont buy another Coticule just yet, wait until you can perform the unicot on at least 6 different Razors with equal ease, then move on to Dilucut, if you can get a Fantastic edge, and I mean Fantastic like 4 passes ATG with no rash burn or bumps, on the majority of razors then you will know your stone completely
IMHO of course.

Best wishes
Ralfson (Dr)
 

jkh

Well-Known Member
Andreas63, if you wouldn't mind - would you please share your thoughts/insights on the difference in pressure with a synthetic hone and the coticule :thumbup:

Or if anyone else cares to comment, I am all ears, er, eyes?
 

Paul

Well-Known Member
Jeremy,

To put it simply, on synthetics, pressure AFTER the bevel setting stage is asking for trouble, and coticules seem to work pretty well with light pressure throughout the whole process. I finish with light strokes, but do use pressure (pointer-finger's worth with half-strokes) up until the finishing on water only. I'm not sure why, but it works

Try it out :)
 

Andreas63

Well-Known Member
richmondesi said:
Jeremy,

To put it simply, on synthetics, pressure AFTER the bevel setting stage is asking for trouble, and coticules seem to work pretty well with light pressure throughout the whole process. I finish with light strokes, but do use pressure (pointer-finger's worth with half-strokes) up until the finishing on water only. I'm not sure why, but it works

Try it out :)
+1 :)

Jeremy, one of my mistakes was too much pressure during the entire honing procedure :blush: : light pressure on my coti works very well (only a little more pressure during the bevel correction part, then "stay light").

It will be very interesting to test my new coticule :love: and see...

I use a little more pressure on the Naniwa 1 000 vs my coticule in the bevel correction part(specially with "circular honing strokes" when I want to speed up the process). With the other hones, I have the Nanis 3k, 8k, 10k and 12k, I'm not really sure...may be I use some more pressure, but if that's the case, then we are talking about grams not kgs!

As I wrote, light is really light...for me it was much lighter than I believed :w00t: :w00t:

Don't give up with cotis! It takes only a little more time compared to synthetics...but it's really worth it :lol:
 

jkh

Well-Known Member
Andreas63 said:
Don't give up with cotis! It takes only a little more time compared to synthetics...but it's really worth it :lol:
I'm not giving up. Heck, I've hardly started :D I have read conflicting information about pressure on synthetics vs coticules. There are posts that state coticules are more tolerant to pressure, but I have also read posts (mostly on other shaving forums) that claim the lightest of light touches is required for coticules.
 

Andreas63

Well-Known Member
garyhaywood said:
great write up,

how did you find the shave of coticule compared to say your naniws?
Thanks Gary :)

both give me very good shaves, but I found that when I shave with a coticule honed razor I don't get any smaller scratches on my faces...it seems that a coti honed razor just cuts hairs, not skin.

Naniwas are smooth too but cotis are smoother. After the Naniwa 12k I use to make some strokes on balsawood coated with Amplex diamond paste 0.25, followed by Cr0x on felt or balsa. The razor gets even more sharper and the smoothness is improuved. The downside is that the razor becomes scary sharp :w00t: :w00t: ...but I like it that way too: it helps a lot against my extreme coarse beard...but with coti I don't not have to have all these steps...just finish with 100 laps on plain water, strop and shave! It's so much simpler and the shaves are actually better; but I have to admit that it took a little time to get there.

With the nanis you learn and get results very quickly...so I vary my razors, cotis and nanis,just to remind me and my shaves how good a coticule razor can shave:lol: :lol:

Another thing I've noted is that a razor honed with coticules needs to be rehoned more often compared to one honed with Naniwas...but that does not matter...honing it's just fun:D
 

garyhaywood

Well-Known Member
i tryed a set of naniwas out thats why i asked. i have to say they are very nice for synthetics,

i finished on 10k only followed by .5 spray the razor was easily shave ready i've not got loads of experiance with them . this was my third atempt and i never failed hht of the 8k but to me the shave just is'nt quite as smooth as coticule but still nice if that what you prefer.
shaving straight of 10k i never liked it may be i'm doing somthing wrong but not for me.

they are defanatley easier to work with especialy for a newby. i still find coticule simple to work with despite what people say, i think it just takes a little more thinking about. with synthetics you hav'nt got slurry to worry about.over all naniwas would be my second choice with out a dout. i use 1k naniwa to set bevel for razor that realy need's it and that hone gets better each time i use it. then i go straight to dilucot and 9 times out of ten the shaves are brill if not i will go ti paste or .5 0.25 spray and then ti paste that gives scary sharp edges and still very smooth
 

Andreas63

Well-Known Member
garyhaywood said:
i tryed a set of naniwas out thats why i asked. i have to say they are very nice for synthetics,

i finished on 10k only followed by .5 spray the razor was easily shave ready i've not got loads of experiance with them . this was my third atempt and i never failed hht of the 8k but to me the shave just is'nt quite as smooth as coticule but still nice if that what you prefer.
shaving straight of 10k i never liked it may be i'm doing somthing wrong but not for me.

they are defanatley easier to work with especialy for a newby. i still find coticule simple to work with despite what people say, i think it just takes a little more thinking about. with synthetics you hav'nt got slurry to worry about.over all naniwas would be my second choice with out a dout. i use 1k naniwa to set bevel for razor that realy need's it and that hone gets better each time i use it. then i go straight to dilucot and 9 times out of ten the shaves are brill if not i will go ti paste or .5 0.25 spray and then ti paste that gives scary sharp edges and still very smooth
As you were writing, it's almost impossible to fail with Naniwas...but may be the "journey" it's not so fun as with cotis...with cotis you feel that you learn new things about your hone all the time!

Try the Naniwa 12k after the 10k: it improuves the edge a lot IMHO. Some says that it leaves big scratches...well I could not see them...I could only feel that the razor got smoother and sharper!

The problems with all the nanis are that they easily get clogged: I ordered a DMT Duo Sharp for that reason, then you have to lap them quite often...if you can stand these smaller problems they are very good synthetic hones.
 
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